Another christmas thread

my daughter and i wrote a letter to santa. i asked her what she wanted me to tell him, and she told me and i wrote it. Basically she said "i want x,y,and z." I was the one who had to be like,"well why dont we tell him merry christmas? why dont we tell him that we'll be leaving cookies for him?" And then she agreed that it was a good idea to include all that in the letter too. :) But if I didnt remind her,her letter would have sounded very greedy and rude,i'm sure.
What a fun job! I would love to read those letters,i bet some of them are really cute.

hmm so if i help my kid write a letter to santa, any random person could read it? to me thats more disturbing than if he is materialistic in it or not, our personal info will be on there. canada post should let parents know that, since usually if you are giving something to the post office, thats the only place that it goes to. :?

and if you ask ANY kid, even the ones who are "raised right" or whatever, what they want to tell santa its usually something to do with what they want for christmas. the most well meaning, well behaved, adorable kids will still burp and fart and laugh hysterically, get seduced by commercials and how "cool" everything seems, and will forget their manners sometimes. my kid has better manners than any adult i know yet when we were at this winter festival and santa said hello, he jumped up and down and yelled gibberish about wanting spiderman stuff and "bideo games." i sure hope no one went home and wrote a post about him on a msg board, since damn, he's rad despite his interpretation of how to approach santa.

they're just kids. keep that in mind when you judge them.

i think this post convinced me to still go ahead with writing a letter to "santa" but i'll just hold onto it or put it in his memory box, and then write him a fake one back on xmas stationary or something, a little while later so it seems real. that way i won't have to worry about canada post or random ppl who work for them judging him for acting his age.

I don't think it was the fact that someone was helping write the letters offended her, more the fact that you feel the need to announce the letter's contents to everyone else in such a condescending way. What does judgement do? Especially towards children? A kid could write a sappy, family filled letter to Santa and really not give a crap, or a kid could write asking what they want, and forget to include family things, and be the sweetest kids ever, you don't know that, nor do you know them.

A lot of organizations around my town sponsor santa letter answering as a community service sort of thing. So yeah, your kid's letter could be read by any random person. In the U.S., that is.

I did it a few years ago. Most of the letters are, in fact, laundry lists of I want x, y, and z, but a few of them are different. Some kids will really go into details about school, family, etc. and just add a wish-list as an afterthought. Perhaps these were written with the help of parents, I don't know.

Letters answered from here get a genuine North Pole postmark!

correct me if i am wrong, but i thought that writing to santa was about telling him what you wanted? If you don't tell him he won't know, so kids feel that they have to ask for what they want. I'm sure they were just having fun and being kids.

If that's true... why did you say this?

"Shocked at how much these kids are asking for" sounds pretty judgemental to me. How can you justify what you wrote as NOT being judgemental?

Really- they are just children that are excited about the holidays.

My 2 year old just realized that birthday=gifts. When he sees something in the store he wants he asks for "birthday." Does that mean he can't truely appreciate and celebrate the day of his birth since he wants gifts? I hope not.

um wow...

around here in a local paper they have a place where you can mail the letters, and you will get replies...

kids are supposed 2 ask for thing for xmas from santa, but in all reality, xmas has been lost by mass marketing and money...oh well

Wow- what a long post that didn't address the whole point of my post, which was you being judgemental to children. You just tried to justify being judgemental but saying it wasn't YOUR fault you said what you said- it's all the PARENTS fault for not making the holidays more "magical" and less about gifts.

i'd like to point out that just becuase these kids wrote to santa and didn't say what you had hoped they'd say doesn't mean that they do feel the magic of christmas. You have stated meny times that christmas was a magical time of you for you, but who said that it isn't for these kids? You read a letter that they wrote to a mythical person who is supposed to bring kids what they want for christmas. What are they supposed to say, how much they love their lives and that don't want anything for xmas. Seriously they are little kids, and you can't judge them by what YOUR childhood was like. So kids are aloud to ask for things that they want, and they don't have to be greedy, little brats. They are kids. Let them be kids.

i guess it makes sense that any number of people could be reading my child's letter, learning where we live, and so on. thats really strange that they would be given such personal information without a criminal record check though. theres a lot of safety issues involved in that, and i don't even think thats just me being all social worker ish here.

i don't really get your attitude here:

you didn't offend me, you insulted my kid, and all other kids who act their age. or maybe i should say, all the kids that don't mimic how YOU were when you were young. my supposed greedy materialistic little boy (my words and not yours, yes, but it doesn't take a genius to see what you were saying in your "comments" that weren't "judgements") well he just loves to recite his wishlist. but we also spend time making christmas ornaments together, singing carols, are making cookies right away, and i tell him stories about the sentimental christmas seasons from my past as he watches me with wide eyes. theres a lot more there than what might be present in a letter that he dictates. and i'm sure many of those same things apply to the kids whose letters you were criticizing.

your "comments" were based on one dimension of who these kids are, and shit girl, there are lots of us here with kids who we love fiercely but sometimes roll our eyes at for how silly they get when they're all "and i want a ___ and a ____ and a ___." its just them being excited about the holidays and that santa dude and all.

all that should be so obvious. hopefully you got over the initial flippant and sarcastic response you gave me and actually read some replies.

[/list]

If i were OP I'd feel really jumped on.. I think shes been told by enough people... imo

Then maybe should should offer an apology instead of continually justifying her judgemental attitude.

http://www.girl-mom.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=11381

That's the "I've been called out!" thread.

The reason why there's multiple mamas chiming in, is because the OP is continually defending why it was okay that she offended people. Being called out sucks, but the proper thing to do is recognize that whether you meant to or not, it hurt or offended people, and apologize. We've all been called out before, and a few of us probably will again ;), it's not slipping up and saying something hurtful that matters, it's how you deal with it once it's been done.

You do get called out a lot. However- you don't like to aplologize until you are nearly FORCED to and after multiple women are hurt. We ALL have been where you are. Really. I remember when I joined GM over 2 years ago I had to unlearn loads of stuff- but you have to be willing to unlearn.

When you defend what you say as "It's ok because of x,y and z" it's a slap in the face to those of us you've offended and honestly- I've been hurt and offended by your posts more times than I care to admit.

I do appreciate you offering an apology. Please think about WHY what you said was hurtful.

Not every part of your life is going to be appropriate for GirlMom. You do not have to post all your beliefs here. If you really think a child is materialistic and greedy for wanting presents- BY ALL MEANS THINK THAT- but don't post it here.

Please show me WHERE, in this thread, anyone attacked you. I reread it and people didn't start chiming in until you had justified yourself TWICE. I don't see it as making the site unwelcoming for members to not be tolerant of being hurt by posts.

Everything I read was respectful to you and calling you out on what you said.

i called you out twice because i felt like you didn't get it. You many have aploigized but then you turn around and continue to try to justicfiy why would said what you. Why not just apoligize and leave it at that?

I just said something cause while reading it I was thinking, I would feel really awful if I was OP....

i understand that, i think anyone would. No one likes being called out. it's how you handle it after someone has called you out and she continues to not handle right. I know would have not continued to say something about it if she had not continued to defend it and restate things that she has already said, and it CONTINES to offend people.

Defending what you say does not = an appology, even if you start out with "I'm sorry..." Most of the time if you (collective, not you personally) are called out it is BECAUSE you've offended someone or your words could really damage someone. It's important to be able to speak here, but it's more important to keep this place a safe space for everyone and if your words violate that safe space it needs to be brought up.

If you don't understand why someone was offended by what you said, stop posting. Read what was written about the issue. Close out of GM for awhile if you need to, to cool off. Come back and reread. Find other threads on the issue and step back to learn and unlearn. Don't keep the flame going and fight about it.

There's a ton more on the link Naivete posted, you can see more why people are called out and even WHO has been. I have. Many of the other really well known mamas here have. It's not a personal attack against you but people defending other mamas and keeping this space safe.

seriously though, we're talking about messages to Santa. How offensive can that really be? I already replied to this thread and said,yes my kid sounded greedy and spoiled,i agree. But I dont think the OP was judging my kid. I dont think she was judging your kid. She didnt mention any names or any particular letter.
i know we have to "call people out" and "keep GM a safe space" but uh, we're talking about kids writing letters so santa here. is this really making anyone feel unsafe?

I think that the idea about the good old days when people/kids appreciated the holiday for the ____ (religion, family, gift giving, etc.) rather than getting gifts never happend. I remember being a kid and it was ALWAYS I wanted xyz for X-mas/Hanukka, it was never about what I wanted to give people. (and, as horrible as it is, I STILL look forward to getting gifts).
And, I think that back in the day, pre-all of us being alive, it was the same way. Not for everyone, everywhere, but for most kiddos, and many adults. Part of the fun IS giving and spending time with family -- but I didn't fully understand that until I was older.

I don't really expect statements like that coming from longer term members. Is it your place to tell people when they are or are not allowed to be offended? No? Didn't think so. It's completely invalidating real feelings.

No naivete, that needs to be said. Some of you guys need to chill out,for real. She was talking about how it made her SAD. She didnt say " look at these little brats, all they want is toys, bad kids, bad parents". She said it made her SAD.
And please, the fact that i am a long term member has absolutely nothing to do with this conversation. I am not a Girlmom longterm member robot. I dont even understand why you said that.

whatevs. i was the first person to say something, and i dont think i need to chill. whats the big deal with pipin in when you see something and think "wth??" and then point it out? is there like a rating system for which issues are allowed to be talked about, and which should be let go? who gets to decide? apparently you feel like you'd be good at the job, but i disagree and so now what?

it was more her attitude in how she replied and talked to other members that was the issue anyways. i could really give a shit if she thinks its sad my kid doesn't wish santa a merry christmas, she doesn't have a child yet and has no idea what its like to mother one, so i take her thoughts on child raising with a teensy grain of salt. but replying to me like that? being all sarcastic and brushing it off? i dunno, theres been times where ppl have disagreed with me and i've though "oh come ON" but the big girl thing to do is at LEAST acknowledge their feelings. isn't that the community thing to do? aren't we still about that? or has it really turned into "but *i* think it should be THIS way and you all are SO WRONG"

i'd rather be told i need to chill than just sit back and let shit that i disagree with slide. i don't care if its letters to santa or someone calling me a baby killer or my friends using racial slurs or people talkin shit on young mamas. an opinion is an opinion, and if the ppl who spread shitty ones get to have theirs heard (and oh how they defend that right) well i get too as well.

like where are you going with this?

But she wasn't talking about child raising,she was just saying it made her kinda sad. I think you took it a little too personal, and then accused her of being some kind of judgemental asshole.(No,you didnt say "judgemental asshole"). I probably would have replied the same as she did, its natural to get defensive.

i'm not really going anywhere deep w/ this. "chill out" pretty much sums it up.You're entitled to think im invalidating feelings,or whatever. I am just piping in and sticking up for someone who i feel was misunderstood.